A lot of agencies charge hourly because they think it's the safe choice. It feels easier to justify, it sounds cleaner, and it feels more professional.
Check out this conversation with Joel Miller. This immediately brought me back to the early days of my agency. He said that every time he sent one of his first value-based proposals, he felt like he was going to end the business. Honestly I remember that feeling myself. This is exactly what it feels like the first time you stop pricing based on your time because you're suddenly forced to answer a much harder question, which is: what is the actual value of the outcome that we create? Most agency owners never fully make that jump. They still stay stuck selling labor, hours, tasks, widgets. Meanwhile the agencies that actually scale sell transformation.
In this episode Joel breaks down how he built an 18 year agency with zero employees. None. Just him and his twin brother. No giant org chart, bloated operations, or payroll stress. Yet they've continued growing year after year by getting crystal clear on positioning, pricing, and the kind of clients that they actually want to work with.
A few moments that stood out to me:
The exact mindset shift that helped him stop defending hourly invoices
Why some referrals convert instantly and others never close
The surprisingly generous client philosophy that actually strengthened profitability
His framework for figuring out what kind of agency you actually want to build
There’s also a section where we talk about confidence vs arrogance in agency sales that I think a lot of younger founders need to hear.
Especially if you still feel like you have to “prove yourself” on every call.
Catch the full episode on The Agency Uplift Podcast
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- Sean
P.S. One of my favorite moments was when Joel talked about asking prospects:
“Why us?”
Not as a sales tactic.
But as a filter.
The reasoning behind that question completely changes how you think about fit, positioning, and client relationships.